So...I'm confused [House Question]

"zeontestpilot" (zeontestpilot) 10/28/2015 at 11:30 • Filed to: Houselopnik, homelopnik

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[ !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! ...sort of. The vent goes nowhere.]

It started with the toddler dropping her ‘pretty’ down this grate, which is when I noticed a dark hole at the bottom of it. On a hunch I went downstairs, turn the light on and returned to be able to see into the basement. I’ve always thought this was a return vent, but now I’m not too sure.

I discovered that the floor for the vent is the ceiling for the basement. You can even see the ‘seam’ of the drywall on the basement ceiling, which pretty much lines up with this not-vent.

Actually, I took my phone and stuck it in and took pics. Below is the pic to the right. You can see insulation and a few lines of Romex.

To the left you can see the box for the basement light.

Now, if this is the return vent, it may be the worst one ever. But I don’t think it is because usually return vents are made of metal. So Oppo, does anyone here have any idea what this is or what it possibly was? Since I’m new to house ownership, I’m baffled.

crowmolly > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:35

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Floor mounted return vent would really only be good for heat. Maybe it was disabled when the basement ceiling went in?

CalzoneGolem > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:35

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That’s a dream catcher.

davedave1111 > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:38

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Cheap-ass way of fixing a stain on the carpet?

Party-vi > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:39

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That is a plenum .

HammerheadFistpunch > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:40

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turn on your fan and use a sheet of paper to test for flow.

leicester > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:40

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Probably just a gateway to an alternate dimension. I wouldn’t worry about it...

There is the possibility it was a return or heating duct at one time, then the ductwork was removed during a basement renovation or changeout of the furnace. (also has older house with some cobbled-together bits)

Azrek > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:44

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I’ll take a stab at this. Is your house from the early part of the 20th century?

Here is where I am going with this. I don’t think it is a return vent. I think that current grate is a facade. I think it used to house a heating element in the vent and was replaced when the house was given forced air or has wall units.

The heating elements in the floor registers fell out of practice in the 60s when some failed elements caused house fires for obvious reasons.

shop-teacher > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:45

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Does that floor “cavity” lead anywhere? Sometimes joist cavities are used as returns, and if that is what’s going on, then it will lead ultimately to either a duct or your furnace. If not (I’m guessing and hoping for your sake not), then it’s an abandoned vent.

BigBlock440 > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:45

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I’m guessing there was a heat source in the basement at one time, a coal or wood stove or something, and the vent was just to allow heat up through the floor. Stove came out, basement ceiling was finished, and the vent is now pointless. Just guessing though.

zeontestpilot > leicester 10/28/2015 at 11:48

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Does that means can visit Aslan? I have so many questions for him, like what is his favorite color?

zeontestpilot > shop-teacher 10/28/2015 at 11:50

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It’s in the direction of a heat and a return vent....hmm...

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:52

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If there’s no airflow at all I’d say cover that sucker up.

zeontestpilot > HammerheadFistpunch 10/28/2015 at 11:52

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...ok, when you say it like that, it seems like I should of did that to begin with. Eh, live and learn.

HammerheadFistpunch > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:53

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yeah, I probably would have done what you did at first too.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:54

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Should be a sheet metal or flex air ducting. Unless your house was built before sheet metal was invented, and it doesn’t look like it. I’ve got some funky shit going on in my house that was built in the 70’s.

zeontestpilot > crowmolly 10/28/2015 at 11:56

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Possibly....I know there's another vent under the carpet, so I wouldn't put it past them.

Ash78, voting early and often > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 11:57

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That’s where The People Under the Stairs store their lunches. Yeah, they brown bag it to keep the costs down.

It might have been a return vent at one time, but the HVAC system was probably fully replaced a long time ago. Sometimes you’ll also see a plenum (I think) between two areas in the same HVAC zone to help equalize temperature and pressure, but that seems like an odd placement.

Montalvo > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:00

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Transfer duct? Sometimes the air goes through a transfer duct to another room before eventually heading to a return to be exhausted.

zeontestpilot > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo 10/28/2015 at 12:02

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Im thinking that too.

zeontestpilot > CalzoneGolem 10/28/2015 at 12:02

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It explains the nightmares then.

zeontestpilot > Azrek 10/28/2015 at 12:04

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The house was built in ‘72-ish. But the house might of been a summer cabin before it was converted to a year-around house. Not totally sure.

ttyymmnn > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:06

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A vestigial hearing duct? In older homes, it is common to have those heating grates in the floor. My parent’s townhouse, built in the early 1900s, has both heat and AC coming out of the floor.

CalzoneGolem > davedave1111 10/28/2015 at 12:06

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I thought that was moving furniture on top of it.

ttyymmnn > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:06

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He's got a thing for apples, iirc.

zeontestpilot > BigBlock440 10/28/2015 at 12:07

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Hmmm, there’s a wood burner, but the previous owner put it in. I think these ‘design choices’ were two owners ago, since they redid some stuff around the house.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:07

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like shop teacher said, sometimes they just box off floor joists to make what I call a “cheater” duct to make the return that way.

In the house I just bought last year they did that in the basement which isn’t fully finished so they cheated and just put metal across the bottom of a floor joist.

jariten1781 > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:08

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Echoing: Probably just a vestige of whatever previous heating method was used. Most people didn't clean up all the old stuff when they rigged in central heat/air.

shop-teacher > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:09

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That requires further investigation then.

Azrek > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:13

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Strange. I haven’t seen a heating element inside a vent in years (Like 10). I knew a few farm houses that still had them. They were like wall units cept in the floor. You would just turn on the element and it would heat your little room.

The one farmhouse I know replaced them with just regular vents as opposed to covering them up when they got Wall units that had heat built in.

That is my guess as you are correct; that vent doesn’t make sense in the current design.

davedave1111 > CalzoneGolem 10/28/2015 at 12:21

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Not if you’re selling/renting with the place empty.

zeontestpilot > shop-teacher 10/28/2015 at 12:21

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I gonna play the ‘knocking test’once I get home. Will definitely update oppo on this mystery as well, lol.

Houses are annoyingly fascinating.

zeontestpilot > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/28/2015 at 12:22

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So it can be a return vent, interesting. ...

zeontestpilot > ttyymmnn 10/28/2015 at 12:23

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What about jelly beans? Will that work too? It's all I have on hand.

zeontestpilot > HammerheadFistpunch 10/28/2015 at 12:24

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I figure the collective known as oppo would be a good place to start understand what’s going on, or to find out what it ‘could’ be, :).

zeontestpilot > CalzoneGolem 10/28/2015 at 12:25

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Is that what we're suppose to do? I just blame the kid.

ttyymmnn > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:29

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That’ll do.

CalzoneGolem > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:30

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While that is a good idea it doesn’t solve the stain on the floor.

zeontestpilot > Azrek 10/28/2015 at 12:30

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Well, some heat vents have taken special liberties. The circular ducts, they had certain sections that were partial cut and pulled apart so a register can be attached via a self-tapping screw. It’s an annoyance when i had to fix a few of them.

zeontestpilot > Ash78, voting early and often 10/28/2015 at 12:32

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Just HV, we have no AC, :). For the plenum, would t there have to be a 2nd vent to equalize it?

shop-teacher > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/28/2015 at 12:34

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Yep, that’s what my return “ducts” are.

zeontestpilot > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 10/28/2015 at 12:35

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I think previous house owners should be thoroughly question sometimes, lol.

Azrek > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:37

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I will agree on your concept this was a cabin not meant for full time residence. So you have a Frankenhouse, if you will excuse the analogy.

I’d recommend getting a full inspection (Not an insurance inspection) to look for other hidden gems. Maybe they could tell you a bit more on what this place used to be or design.

Man...I’d love to see if you have a real breaker box or fuses. I love those old fuses...

zeontestpilot > ttyymmnn 10/28/2015 at 12:37

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Had it always had AC?

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > shop-teacher 10/28/2015 at 12:38

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Oddly enough they only “cheated” on ONE of them.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:38

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return yes, I don’t think they’re good for the actual outflow from the furnace, but I could be wrong.

zeontestpilot > Montalvo 10/28/2015 at 12:39

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It's the only one I see, unless the other was covered up by carpet.

shop-teacher > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:39

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Indeed they are.

Have fun!

zeontestpilot > jariten1781 10/28/2015 at 12:40

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I can understand that, we have more light switches than lights in the house.

ttyymmnn > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 12:41

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I don’t think so. They bought the house in the early ‘70s and it was a complete dump. They got it super cheap and pumped a ton of money to renovate it. It is a three-story townhouse, and I think it always had central heat, but the AC was added later. On the third floor, there is only a floor vent in the front room. The other two bedrooms up there have baseboard electric heat that was added as part of the renovation. There were also fireplaces in many of the rooms, and holes in the wall that accepted stovepipes. Yeah, it’s that old.

zeontestpilot > Azrek 10/28/2015 at 12:53

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It’s a breaker box, but if it counts for anything, it isn’t original. It’s right over where the original staircase went downstairs. I figured that when they converted the garage to living space, they changed the direction of the staircase and put the breaker box in the current location.

But I DO have this gem below. Not sure how many other houses have this, or have it inside the house, but it’s a....umm...breaker box for the breaker box? Not sure what it’s called. When the electrical wires come into the house, it goes into this, then the breaker box. It's like a master switch for everything.

I’ve been mapping everything in the house, to get an idea what connects to what. Essentially, I'm learning my own house, :).

Azrek > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 13:04

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Holy crap...a Fusetron! FUSETRON!!

Basically...it is a means to prevent burnout or blackouts. It helps regulate the power. I’d guess the FUSETRON (never gets old) was put in after you got a HVAC unit.

I’d almost wonder if the house was on a 240v or similar generator at sometime in the past before getting converted to US Standard.

Interesting house.

shop-teacher > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/28/2015 at 13:04

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They are considered unsafe for supply lines. A lot of places no longer allow it for returns either.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > shop-teacher 10/28/2015 at 13:13

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Yeah I’m sure my 41 year old house is “grandfathered”

shop-teacher > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/28/2015 at 13:37

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Oh yeah, building codes are always grandfathered that way. Nobody is going to come in and make you rip out and replace your duct work. It’s possible that if you did a major renovation that involved moving/adding duct work, then the building department might make you upgrade that. That depends a lot on the area your in ... or whether or not the building inspector is a dick and/or having a bad day.

Of course none of that applies if you don’t get a building permit. Personally, I never do for interior work ... it’s my house and I do what I want!

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 13:38

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I have just reciently added vents to the outdoors for our dryer and bathroom, which previously vented to the laundry room. We were wondering why the laundry wouldn’t dry very fast and it smelled like poop when someone was in the bathroom. THE HOUSE IS 40 YEARS OLD, who the heck doesn’t route dryer vents outside? Also, I have replaced about every light switch in the house. For some reason almost every switch was broken.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > shop-teacher 10/28/2015 at 13:40

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Haha, we just had a bathroom done, and by done I mean half bath turned into a full bath. a bunch of plumbing, electrical (heated floors too!) concrete slab cracked...no permit

I had told him i wanted one but then we were like....nah lets just do this.

shop-teacher > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/28/2015 at 13:53

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I do most of my work myself, and what I don’t I have trusted sub-contractors do it. My dad is a contractor, so a lot of these guys have known me since I was a little kid. The building department can only get in my way and cost me money.

Unfortunately when I do stuff outside, I have to pull a permit. I forgot to get one when we redid the roof last year, and the building inspector (who I had never seen once in five years of living in this fairly smallish town) shut the crew down within an hour. I didn’t mind getting the permit, but the guy was a colossal dickhead! I even had to pull a permit when I fixed the siding on my garage. No inspections of course, I just need to give them a check for the privilege of making the neighborhood look better.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > shop-teacher 10/28/2015 at 13:58

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I’m sure it’s an ordinance thing, but I can’t believe you need a permit to do stuff yourself like siding.

shop-teacher > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/28/2015 at 14:02

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Yep. the garage needed a new overhead door, roof, and facia/soffits. As well as the siding repair. There were boxes to check off for each one of those, and each had their own line item price. Came out to something like $80 so I could make my garage not look like a piece of shit. It still kind of is a piece of shit, but at least it doesn’t look like it anymore.

zeontestpilot > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 10/28/2015 at 14:16

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One fan goes into the attic, which I will reroute next summer to the outside, along with the basements fan.

We have 6 more extra light switches than we have lights. 1 doesn’t have power, the other 5 do. And no, they don’t respond to outlets, that was my first thought. I really wanna tear down the walls to find out where they go, but my wife says no.

zeontestpilot > Azrek 10/28/2015 at 14:21

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Thought you’d like to see it. Also, just HV, no AC here. The house is in the country, if it makes any difference.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > shop-teacher 10/28/2015 at 14:24

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That’s f-ed up man.

shop-teacher > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/28/2015 at 14:26

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Agreed. I neglected to tell them that I was modifying the structure to fit a wider garage door in, so at least I pulled that over on them.

Also, 18’ garage doors are the shit! 10/10, would do again.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > shop-teacher 10/28/2015 at 14:37

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I wish I had room my man. Biggest drawback of my house is the small garage. It’s a 2 car garage, that’s more like a 1.9 car garage.

shop-teacher > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/28/2015 at 14:42

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Yeah, most of them are. When we bought our house 5 years ago, we bought the one with the biggest garage in our price range. A good size garage or at least room to build one was a must. The thing that sucks about my garage is the concrete slab is in terrible condition. I really wanted to knock it down and rebuild it, but I just couldn’t affords it.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > shop-teacher 10/28/2015 at 14:46

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Yeah that’s a project we’re hoping to do next year. The problem is there’s no room around the door to make it bigger, and I don’t think we can expand if you can see the garage door runner is right up against the wall, same on the other side.

Speaking of annoying building laws, I’m not allowed to build it wider while still on my own property because it’s too close to the public sidewalk (I have to keep 15 feet)

shop-teacher > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/28/2015 at 15:24

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Yeah, no room there. I’m also on a corner lot, I have to stay 30’ from the lot line ... I hate it!

leicester > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 15:33

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Not sure, but I’d keep an eye on the toddler. If she starts talking about the ‘TV people’ or starts speaking backwards, you might want to hire a professional.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > shop-teacher 10/28/2015 at 15:33

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I can’t even have a FENCE within 15 of the sidewalk. I had to do a shorter fence on one side of my house because my “neighbor” (aka house is mostly behind me, it’s a weird location, screengrab below to explain). but I couldn’t put a privacy heigh fence because it was “in front of the back of their house”.

The one on the top right is the one I couldn’t built the fence. If you follow the “line” of the back of my house, it goes straight to the street to the left of his driveway. Dude’s behind me.

shop-teacher > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/28/2015 at 15:36

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That is incredibly annoying. Fence rules around here aren’t too bad, I can go right up to the sidewalk. Haven’t had the cash for that yet.

You can tell a Finn but you can't tell him much > zeontestpilot 10/28/2015 at 22:24

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How old is the house and did it have a wood fired drive in the basement at one time? In older wood heated homes that was a very common way to get heat to an upper floor. Cut a big hole in the floor and put a grate over it. The ceiling in the basement was probably dry walled later if it is an older home.

zeontestpilot > You can tell a Finn but you can't tell him much 10/29/2015 at 06:18

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It was built in ‘72-’73, my grandpa did the original electrical for the house, so I quizzed him on it. Wood fired drive, is that like a wood burning stove by any chance?

I’m the fourth owner of this house. The last owner installed a wood burner. The furnace was either installed in the house when it was built, or one of the other two owners had it installed it. Many houses out here were originally summer cottages, but I’m notsure if mine was or not.

You can tell a Finn but you can't tell him much > zeontestpilot 10/29/2015 at 06:49

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Auto correct got me. “Wood fired drive” is supposed to be wood fired stove.